Why conformation shows?

[barongsd]

It seems there are a lot of people on this board who have a bad impression of conformation showing or who have no knowledge of conformation showing. I thought it might be fun if we started a thread about basic showing and why we even have conformation shows. Maybe some of the more experienced show people can help explain how a show is run and their purpose.

[JanisN]

Yes please!!!! As I explained in another thread, I'm TOTALLY ignorant regarding AKC/UKC/CKC showing!

Can you tell me what you look for in a puppy when you're gauging their potential for the show ring? And once you've decided to try with a particular puppy, how do you go about training and conditioning?

I'm SURE that we look for totally different things and would really like to know about this!

JanisN

[barongsd]

This might have been a bad time for me to start this thread. LOL .... we are off to a show in Cleveland Ohio early Thursday morning ..... We will be showing Baron on Friday, Saturday and Sunday .... hope we can keep this thread going for a bit until I get back .... I think it will be very interesting ....

[Norm]

For the a,b,c,'s of showing in the AKC ring go to this site: www.akc.org/dic/events/conform/begnshws.cfm

Janis I will try to answer your questions.

How to select a show puppy: You look for the same thing in a puppy that you look for in an adult. Let's assume that temperament is a given. I looked for good sidegate. Coming & going is difficult to access in a puppy as their muscles & ligaments have not fully developed. I still looked for a pup that was fairly true coming & going.

It is important to know the lines you are dealing with as different lines develop differently. Some develop slowly and other much faster. The best animal I ever owned I picked when she was 5 weeks old and I saw her move across the puppy pen. She had it all then and only got better with age. With my own litters I would constantly watch them. We would take them out to the yard to watch them interact and move around. I always felt the ideal age to pick a puppy was three months. I was taught that the way they looked at 3 months was what they would come back to upon maturity and it usually worked. After three months puppies start going through growing stages and are difficult to evaluate. I preferred a dry, hard puppy vs a wet, sloppy type.

If you have the room it is best to keep the best puppies to grow out and watch develop until you make your final decision.

As for training: The most important thing is to keep the puppy happy and to make the training a fun experience. I would take a show puppy and have someone take it on a leash while someone else would stay in front of the puppy baiting it would food. The handler would encourage the pup to move toward the food while saying "move out". You were then training the puppy to move out at the end of the lead when being shown and not hold back. I would also train the puppy on top of a crate to stack and stand for inspection. You examined the teeth, felt for testicles and went over it's body. Later you would have strangers do the same thing. I also taught the puppy to move around a ring. At age 3 months I would start showing the puppy in fun matches so it could experience actual show conditions.

Randy to answer your post: The obvious reason for a show is to have others see your dog. Dog shows originated with horse people. Dog standards and terminology are based on the standards for horses(don't forget that Von Stephanitz was a cavalry officer). The original dog shows were based on horse shows. Dog owners wanted people to see what their animals produced in an effort to sell puppies & adults and to encourage the use of their males as studs. They eventually evolved into the type of competitions that we know today. My primary reason for going to a dog show was to see what bloodlines went well with others for breeding purposes and to look for potential stud dogs for my bitches. I was more interested in seeing good dogs then winners (unless of course I was showing a dog that day ).

[gsdoglady]

Good Job, Norm. (seem to be saying that a lot...)
Cappy and Gloria had movies of the Spice litter as they were growing up. It was pretty amazing as it showed how those pups at 5 weeks were the miniatures of what they became as adults. Their lines, at that time, were pretty consistent about that.

I like to look for a nicely balanced athletic pup - that doesn't mean unangulated, just as balanced as possible. I also stop looking at them after they are about 4 months old as some go through pretty scary stages. This is the time to trust your early judgement.

If I am looking for a show pup I will give a lot of credit for a pup's show attitude as that will "sell" him to a lot of judges. Sometimes the more correct dog without the "Look at ME" attitude does not have a chance.

[barongsd]

of course, being the novice (and idealist) that I am ..... I believe that conformation dog shows are also for the betterment of the breed. Champion dogs should be the cream of the crop ... those that most closely represent the "standard" .... they should be our breeds future, .... of course in reality the breeds future is being dictated by a few judges .... I was at a dog show this week end and seen 90% of the dogs were to big (and I don't mean a 1/2 inch to big either) ..... I watched locked hocks, dirty comers & goers, dogs with no rears, bouncy gaits. ..... oh geesh .... now I am sounding like sour grapes .... but the future of our breed worries me ....

[Currmudgeon]

barongsd said:

I believe that conformation dog shows are also for the betterment of the breed. Champion dogs should be the cream of the crop

That's good as far as it goes, but breeding is more complicated than that. It's nice to see the champions and argue about why this or that dog didn't win. But it's more important to look at the bloodline combinations, as Norm pointed out. Seing what the various dogs look like gives you some hint what you will get by combining dog A and bitch B. That's probably more important than looking at the BOB or the Sieger, because most of us don't own those genes.

You can't breed all the combinations out there. But you can look at many of them at a show.

[gsdoglady]

As a breeder, I go to shows to look at what certain combinations produced. Actually it is the producing ability of the parents that we evaluate at a show, not the producing ability of the winners.

There is an old saying often heard from experienced breeders: "If you like the son, breed to the father". Too often we forget that and rush to breed to the current winners just because they are winners.

Another truism is that the best show dog is not necessarily the best producer. My explanation for that is that it requires something a little bit exagerated to get a judge's attention. The best producer is generally the most CORRECT, but not necessarily noticably "showy" dog.

[JOVON]

I totally agree Ruth! Attitude is a must in the ring. Judges want a dog that is having fun out there!! You can have a gorgoeus dog conformationally, but has no attitude, youre a goner!!! I've seen some lesser dogs that had tons of attitude, win more, due to their animation. These dogs usually are a nice, balanced dog, but may not have the shoulder and rear drives some others have.